[Grok-dev] Re: Benefits of Grok -- please contribute

Martin Aspeli optilude at gmx.net
Sun May 13 18:40:48 EDT 2007

Sebastian Ware wrote:
> Hi all!
> These would be useful questions to get answered from as many  
> different perspectives as possible in order to create a strong and  
> compelling message:
> (you can keep the answers short, just so one gets the point)
> 1 What does a developer look for when choosing a web development  
> framework?

o Safety and productivity returns on their time investment.

o Ease of learning and speed of development

o Low risk of getting tied in, in terms of decent integration with other 

o Ability to migrate to other platforms later, or at least, to share 
components with other platforms

> 2 What does a manager look for when choosing a web development  
> framework?

Same as above, plus:

o Availability of support

o Ability to hire programmers who know the platform

o Cost of said programmers

o Inherent stability

o Security

o Ability to integrate with existing technologies used by the business 
(e.g. databases, other applications)

> 3 Which frameworks are direct competitors to Grok?

o Pylons

o Django

o TurboGears

o Ruby-on-Rails

o Zope 2

o Plain Zope 3

o Plone (arguably)

> 4 What are the benefits of choosing Grok (over "competing" frameworks)?

o The collective experience that lies behind Zope 3

o The power and diversity of Zope 3 components

o Ability to grow horizontally and vertically, due to the above

o The speed of Grok development

> 5 What might be considered drawbacks with Grok compared to  
> "competing" frameworks?

o Youth

o Size of developer base

> 6 If someone explained Grok in an article or review in a single  
> paragraph, what would we want it to say?

I'm too tired to dream up a paragraph, but something like the benefits 
above: It's not just a random invention, it's not really as new as it 
looks (because of Zope 3), it's based on years of experience developing 
with and teaching Python/Zope.

It's different - e.g., aspect orientation (adapters) and persistence (no 

And mostly - it's fun and productive!

> 7 If I described a "beginner" Grok newbie, what features in Grok  
> would interest him the most?

o Productivity

o The object/aspect-oriented nature of Grok (and, really, of Zope 3 and 
the ZODB)

> 8 If I described an "advanced" Grok newbie, what features in Grok  
> would interest him the most?

o Ability to continue to use Zope 3 packages and techniques

o Speed and agility over plain Zope 3 development (may not appeal to 
everyone, tough - ZCML is not universally hated :-)

o Object/aspect-orientation

> 9a Is there a silver bullet? (Something that if one gets it, just  
> puts Grok in a class of itself with regards to competitors)
> 9b Is the silver bullet easy to explain?

There is no silver bullet. There never is. Don't try to make one up just 
because it sounds like there should be one. :)


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