[Grok-dev] Re: Organizing the further development effort

Sebastian Ware sebastian at urbantalk.se
Sat May 26 02:12:35 EDT 2007

26 maj 2007 kl. 06.00 skrev Uli Fouquet:

> Hi Sebastian!
> On Fri, 2007-05-25 at 20:38 +0200, Sebastian Ware wrote:
>> I have proposed a new site design for grok.zope.org.
> I have seen it and personally would _love_ to see something like  
> this in
> the admin-UI. Especially the buttons are very good looking, though I
> agree with Lennart in respect of their contrast. A little bit more
> brightness would be fine for me and my very old monitor (which turns
> nearly every colour into some kind of grey). Would you mind me to
> 'steal' some of your artwork for the admin interface?
> Regarding the grokzope3-problem I think it is a good idea to mention
> Zope 3 - even in the logo. But, yes, it could be misunderstood if both
> names are put consecutively. Your subtly designed shadows in the logo
> made me think about putting "Grok" on top of "Zope3", because Grok in
> reality is built on top of zope3 and zope3 is the "big shadow" always
> backing up grok. Some sketches to illustrate that can be found here:
> 	https://gf1.gnufix.de/~uli/grok/logo
> They are only there to give an idea of how it could look.

This was an excellent exercise!

I found variant 6 and 7 to be the best candidates, but I still see a  
lot of problems when adapting it to different scenarios (small size,  
signs, ascii art). The "Product name" + "Category name" (or vice  
versa) is quite a common way of showing the relationship between  
brands. By only using Grok in text we will emphasise that the name of  
the framework is "Grok". I think my "less fancy" version will be the  
easiest to use consistently.

>>  I would be happy
>> to give some feedback on the admin interface too. I could probably
>> also supply some graphics bits and pieces so we could make it look
>> nice(r than any other admin interface on the planet...:p).
> You are very welcome :-) Your apparent skills in graphics should give
> the layout an enormous boost.
>> I would also be interested in discussing the use of AJAX in the
>> admin. I have used a really simple method myself (with the help of
>> Mochikit) which gives excellent degradation for browsers without
>> Javascript and hardly requires any AJAXification of the underlying  
>> code.
> Ooh, well, why not? I had no plans for AJAX-support yet, but what you
> say sounds promising. And some more AJAX-experiences would improve the
> documentation as well. So let's do it if we can agree on the following
> three rules of thumb: (1) every functionality of the interface  
> should be
> accessible also with a non-Javascript browser. (2) Functionality  
> should
> go before comfort: First make it work, then make it work nicely. This
> means, that I would insert AJAXification as a stage-2 task into my  
> todo
> list (keeping it always in mind during stage 1). (3) If Martijn,  
> Philipp
> or Christian say no, then it won't happen (well, at least in  
> public;-).
> But I am sure, that people (including myself) would appreciate some
> AJAXification - and the nicest interface on the planet can hardly cope
> without it ;-) Any objections from the list?

Sounds excellent. I will explain the technique I used and you can try  
it out.

> Your experiences with Mochikit might be very helpful for me. I never
> tried it before, but everthing you tell about it sounds very  
> promising.
> May I contact you via PM?

I suck at Javascript!!! I only suck marginally less at Mochikit...

'Scuse my ignorance, but what is PM? contact away :)

>> All I want in return is an inside on when you are explicitly lying in
>> the docs... I am so easily fooled... ;)
> It's a deal :-)

You're on! :)


> Regards
> -- 
> Uli
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