[ZWeb] right hand margin
Mark Fallu
Mark Fallu" <mfallu@optushome.com.au
Sat, 5 Apr 2003 14:10:00 +1000
May I suggest a slightly wider right hand margin for the news and products
column.
The current 1-2 pixels is different to the left hand column and gives the
appearance that stuff is running off the right hand edge of the page. An
extra few pixels of whitespace will add a little more balance...
That said - it is looking good and I can't wait to see it all populated with
content.
Cheers,
Mark F
----- Original Message -----
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Sent: Saturday, April 05, 2003 11:37 AM
Subject: Zope-web digest, Vol 1 #653 - 11 msgs
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> Today's Topics:
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> 1. Re: NZO Alpha Announcement (Jeffrey P Shell)
> 2. Re: [Zope3-dev] fix zope 3 wiki urls ? (Jeffrey P Shell)
> 3. Re: NZO Alpha Announcement (Sidnei da Silva)
> 4. Re: NZO Alpha Announcement (Sidnei da Silva)
> 5. Re: Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ? (Simon Michael)
> 6. Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: [ZWeb] Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ? (Jeffrey P
Shell)
> 7. Re: Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ? (Simon Michael)
> 8. Re: Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ? (Simon Michael)
> 9. Re: Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ? (Jeffrey P Shell)
> 10. Re: NZO Alpha Announcement (Jeffrey P Shell)
> 11. Re: NZO Alpha Announcement (Jeffrey P Shell)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 15:32:44 -0700
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] NZO Alpha Announcement
> Cc: zope-web@zope.org
> To: Sidnei da Silva <sidnei@x3ng.com>
> From: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
>
> On Friday, April 4, 2003, at 08:58 AM, Sidnei da Silva wrote:
>
> > | >- You wrote something about linking the mailinglist navigation to
> > | >lists.zope.org/ mail.zope.org. I think it's bad to have links in
> > | >the menu directly go to other sites when the user doesn't expect
> > | >it (with Zope Exits the user expects to leave the zope site). Why
> > | >not create a clear, nice looking subpage describing the various
> > | >Zope mailinglist and how to use them, e.g. warn that zope@zope.org
> > | >is a high-traffic list, that the lists are archived on the web,
> > | >etc. That page could have a clear link to lists.zope.org. I think
> > | >mailman 2.1 new templating system even uses ZPT (not sure), so it's
> > | >even possible to give the mailman pages a zope.org look and feel
> > | >(not very high priority, though).
> > |
> > | Another option is to use an extra icon for links that go offsite from
> > | large link lists, and those links should always open in a new window.
> > | If it's a subpage containing all off-site links, this isn't
> > necessary.
> >
> > Looks like there is consensus that opening new windows is not
> > good. Will leave it as-is.
>
> Please then, no links to zope.com for the Roadmap - which I see has now
> been fixed.
>
> I appreciate Pieter's roadmap page - but does this need to be a Wiki?
> Now there are all these extra headers and toolbars and links and
> sub-sub-sub tables and question marks getting in the way of trying to
> ascertain the current Zope release information. Too many header bars
> (the site bar and the wiki bar) feel like they're pushing information
> down on what wants to be a standalone page (evidenced by the very small
> table of contents, which shows up with NO NZO skin around it...). But
> I guess there's some Wiki skin work still ongoing? I don't know what
> can be done about this, but the page flow currently is just rather
> noisy.
>
> If the Roadmap page should remain a Wiki page, then maybe pages like
> this are good candidates for the giganto-wiki that Simon proposed a few
> months back. I'm still leery of having the dichotomy of WikiSpace
> versus NormalContentSpace creating confusing navigation and duplicated
> content, but I'd rather have that than NormalContentSpace pierced by
> many little Wikis.
>
> Finally, why is Plone on the Roadmap page? Are we setting a dangerous
> precedent by putting third party things on there? I think that the
> Products listing page should help people find links to Plone, ZWiki,
> Kontientor, etc, and the people behind those projects should update
> their own roadmaps and release plans in their own areas - mostly so
> they don't have to worry about updating yet-one-more-place.
>
> > | >What about the wiki's? What's the current state of them? Are you
> > | >planning to use CMFWiki or Zwiki?
>
> > For now, were just converting everything to ZWiki. As Simon pointed
> > out on Zope3-dev, the whole experience will be improved just by doing
> > this, because the current wikis on Zope.org lack key features.
>
> I was unaware that CMFWiki's capabilities had been folded back in to
> ZWiki, my mistake.
>
> Erk. Has the software been updated yet? I'm getting lots of bugs when
> trying to make an alternate roadmap page. It's not remembering what
> I'm editing the page as, and when DTML is there as an option (which I'm
> not purposefully selecting - it just gets reselected every time I click
> 'edit'), I get an AttributeError, "runFitOn".
>
> > | >> - Objects have a 'obsolete' workflow state, that will be used to
> > mark
> > | >> old content and remove it on the next round of migration.
> > | >remove it? are zope members given a long period of time to clean
> > | >up their home dirs? (i don't think a period such as two weeks that
> > | >is used on plone.org is appropriate for zope.org). Another solution
> > | >is to make old content hard to find (e.g. moving it to old.zope.org
> > | >or not searching it by default)
> > |
> > | We have to be careful about 'old.zope.org'. We don't want to get too
> > | dependent on that being around providing obscure functionality.
> > This
> > | happened with the old Collector(s) on 'classic.zope.org'.
> >
> > No old.zope.org please.
>
> I agree, from painful experience from last time we did this :).
>
> > | On top of what Pieter pointed out, I have something else of my own:
> > the
> > | ZSP page is in terrible shape on new.zope.org. I don't know if I've
> > | ever seen a version of it that I've liked. What are the plans for
> > it,
> > | and how can I help get it up to something comparable with what exists
> > | on Zope.org now - but better (ability to filter/search ZSP's by
> > region,
> > | for example)?
> >
> > I made a first try at it, http://dev.nzo.zope.org/Resource/ZSP
> >
> > This is a new product called CMFContentList, which makes configurable
> > listings of objects. Next things I need to add are batching and
> > searching. Let me know what you think.
>
> There should be something separating the entries - either an HR type
> separator or alternate row colors. Other than that, it looks fine.
>
> > | Coming in as anonymous, I got a login error by clicking on "The Zope
> > | Book" off of the front page (and in Safari, the login error came
> > across
> > | as plain-text HTML instead of rendered).
> >
> > Ack! Safari seems to not be handling a content type header or
> > something.
>
> And I'm running some sneaky betas anyways, not always the best policy
> :).
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 15:49:10 -0700
> Cc: zope3-dev@zope.org,
> zope-web@zope.org
> To: Simon Michael <simon@joyful.com>
> From: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
> Subject: [ZWeb] Re: [Zope3-dev] fix zope 3 wiki urls ?
>
> On Friday, April 4, 2003, at 01:38 PM, Simon Michael wrote:
>
> > The current situation is this:
> >
> > http://zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/ - works,
> > canonical
> >
> > http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/ - used by the newsletter, works, transforms
> > to..
> >
> > http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/ -
> > works
> >
> > http://zope.org/Zope3/ - doesn't work
> >
> > Proposal - could we do some or all of these things ?
> > I think they will be quick to do and will not impact other sites.
> >
> > 1. add a SiteRoot in the wiki folder to preserve the shorter url. I
> > have
> > manage access (thanks Jim) but not for that.
> >
> > 2. replace /Zope3 with, or add, a /zope3 alias (& make
> > dev.zope.org/zope3
> > canonical)
> >
> > 3. add a /zope3 alias on zope.org (& make zope.org/zope3 canonical)
>
> Would it be better to wait for NZO on this? 'dev.zope.org/Zope3' is
> just a Redirector object that's in the DevSite root - put there because
> Zope 3 is still a development project. I imagine that by the time it's
> not a development project, we can have a more cohesive Zope 3
> information site together (or in process) running on NZO.
>
> The redirecter object was made because
> http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/ is
> just way too long of a URL to remember and enter, especially in
> Structured Text (it takes almost an entire line on its own, making it
> difficult to inline and still preserve Structure).
>
> But it was just made as a simple solution to a general annoyance. I
> don't want to change anything major on the current Zope.org site,
> especially in the development section, until it's known how it will
> exist in New Zope Org.
>
> I'd rather see a structure like:
>
> zope.org/2.6/
> zope.org/2.7/
> zope.org/X3/ ==> the development wiki
> zope.org/3.0/ --> 3.0 information and documentation when it arrives
> zope.org/3.1/ --> and 3.1
>
> Or, quite possibly, it would be better to put a product name in front,
> ala:
>
> zope.org/zope/2.7/
> zope.org/zope/X3/
>
> We could do this now and have the URL's point to the respective
> development wikis. As final releases happen, either update the links
> or information in each respective area.
>
> As I cited earlier, it's great to be able to go to www.python.org/1.5/
> and also to www.python.org/2.3/ and have a pretty good expectation of
> what you'll find at each URL.
>
> I'm crossposting this to zope-web to see what they think.
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:01:59 -0300
> From: Sidnei da Silva <sidnei@x3ng.com>
> To: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
> CC: zope-web@zope.org
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] NZO Alpha Announcement
>
> Jeffrey P Shell wrote:
> > On Friday, April 4, 2003, at 08:58 AM, Sidnei da Silva wrote:
> >> | Another option is to use an extra icon for links that go offsite from
> >> | large link lists, and those links should always open in a new window.
> >> | If it's a subpage containing all off-site links, this isn't
necessary.
> >>
> >> Looks like there is consensus that opening new windows is not
> >> good. Will leave it as-is.
> >
> >
> > Please then, no links to zope.com for the Roadmap - which I see has now
> > been fixed.
>
> Nice huh :P
>
> > I appreciate Pieter's roadmap page - but does this need to be a Wiki?
> > Now there are all these extra headers and toolbars and links and
> > sub-sub-sub tables and question marks getting in the way of trying to
> > ascertain the current Zope release information. Too many header bars
> > (the site bar and the wiki bar) feel like they're pushing information
> > down on what wants to be a standalone page (evidenced by the very small
> > table of contents, which shows up with NO NZO skin around it...). But I
> > guess there's some Wiki skin work still ongoing? I don't know what can
> > be done about this, but the page flow currently is just rather noisy.
>
> Yes, Limi is working on ZWiki skin beautification to get it ready for
> 0.18.0.
>
> I agree with you that this roadmap page has way too many whistles. I
> dislike table borders entirely.
>
> > If the Roadmap page should remain a Wiki page, then maybe pages like
> > this are good candidates for the giganto-wiki that Simon proposed a few
> > months back. I'm still leery of having the dichotomy of WikiSpace
> > versus NormalContentSpace creating confusing navigation and duplicated
> > content, but I'd rather have that than NormalContentSpace pierced by
> > many little Wikis.
>
> I think that a Roadmap page is a nice candidate for a Wiki, but whatever
> is suggested would be fine for me.
>
> > Finally, why is Plone on the Roadmap page? Are we setting a dangerous
> > precedent by putting third party things on there? I think that the
> > Products listing page should help people find links to Plone, ZWiki,
> > Kontientor, etc, and the people behind those projects should update
> > their own roadmaps and release plans in their own areas - mostly so they
> > don't have to worry about updating yet-one-more-place.
>
> Thats a *gooooood* question. Why Plone is here? Pieter?
>
> >> | >What about the wiki's? What's the current state of them? Are you
> >> | >planning to use CMFWiki or Zwiki?
> >
> >
> >> For now, were just converting everything to ZWiki. As Simon pointed
> >> out on Zope3-dev, the whole experience will be improved just by doing
> >> this, because the current wikis on Zope.org lack key features.
> >
> >
> > I was unaware that CMFWiki's capabilities had been folded back in to
> > ZWiki, my mistake.
> >
> > Erk. Has the software been updated yet? I'm getting lots of bugs when
> > trying to make an alternate roadmap page. It's not remembering what I'm
> > editing the page as, and when DTML is there as an option (which I'm not
> > purposefully selecting - it just gets reselected every time I click
> > 'edit'), I get an AttributeError, "runFitOn".
>
> err... my fault. There was a editform laying around in 'custom'. I
> cleaned that and cvs upped ZWiki. It still has the bug on selecting the
> format though :(
>
> >> | On top of what Pieter pointed out, I have something else of my own:
the
> >> | ZSP page is in terrible shape on new.zope.org. I don't know if I've
> >> | ever seen a version of it that I've liked. What are the plans for
it,
> >> | and how can I help get it up to something comparable with what exists
> >> | on Zope.org now - but better (ability to filter/search ZSP's by
region,
> >> | for example)?
> >>
> >> I made a first try at it, http://dev.nzo.zope.org/Resource/ZSP
> >>
> >> This is a new product called CMFContentList, which makes configurable
> >> listings of objects. Next things I need to add are batching and
> >> searching. Let me know what you think.
> >
> >
> > There should be something separating the entries - either an HR type
> > separator or alternate row colors. Other than that, it looks fine.
>
> Good. The nice thing about the way I did this is that you just need to
> change a macro on portal_skins to get a new look.
>
> ~dc
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 20:06:45 -0300
> From: Sidnei da Silva <sidnei@x3ng.com>
> To: Sidnei da Silva <sidnei@x3ng.com>
> CC: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>, zope-web@zope.org
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] NZO Alpha Announcement
>
> Sidnei da Silva wrote:
> >> Erk. Has the software been updated yet? I'm getting lots of bugs
> >> when trying to make an alternate roadmap page. It's not remembering
> >> what I'm editing the page as, and when DTML is there as an option
> >> (which I'm not purposefully selecting - it just gets reselected every
> >> time I click 'edit'), I get an AttributeError, "runFitOn".
> >
> >
> > err... my fault. There was a editform laying around in 'custom'. I
> > cleaned that and cvs upped ZWiki. It still has the bug on selecting the
> > format though :(
>
> But it fixed the "runFitOn" problem, though.
>
> ~dc
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 5
> To: zope-web@zope.org
> From: Simon Michael <simon@joyful.com>
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ?
> Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 16:32:17 -0800
> Organization: Joyful Systems
> Cc: zope3-dev@zope.org
>
> Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com> writes:
> > Would it be better to wait for NZO on this?
>
> I don't think so. Here's an incremental step that's easy to do and will
> provide immediate relief for zope 3 wiki users. Incremental progress is
> good. Your other ideas should wait till nzo, sure.
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 17:57:11 -0700
> Subject: Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: [ZWeb] Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ?
> Cc: zope3-dev@zope.org,
> zope-web@zope.org
> To: Simon Michael <simon@joyful.com>
> From: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
>
> I'm not sure what the relief you're asking for is. Just another
> redirector in the root of the Z3 Wiki? Or something that would keep
> all Zope 3 Wiki URL's short and sweet?
>
> On Friday, April 4, 2003, at 05:32 PM, Simon Michael wrote:
>
> > Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com> writes:
> >> Would it be better to wait for NZO on this?
> >
> > I don't think so. Here's an incremental step that's easy to do and
> > will
> > provide immediate relief for zope 3 wiki users. Incremental progress is
> > good. Your other ideas should wait till nzo, sure.
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Zope3-dev mailing list
> > Zope3-dev@zope.org
> > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope3-dev
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 7
> To: zope-web@zope.org
> From: Simon Michael <simon@joyful.com>
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ?
> Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 16:52:28 -0800
> Organization: Joyful Systems
> Cc: zope3-dev@zope.org
>
> PS - yes, I know I'm asking ZC to do work for me and everyone there is
> busy.. I thought I was going to be able to do it and the task naturally
> led to this list. I'm hoping it's not a big technical deal and we can get
> this done.
>
> If not, we have a problem. Urls like
> http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/FAQ make
> us look silly. :)
>
> Thanks,
> -Simon
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 8
> To: zope-web@zope.org
> From: Simon Michael <simon@joyful.com>
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ?
> Date: Fri, 04 Apr 2003 17:06:44 -0800
> Organization: Joyful Systems
> Cc: zope3-dev@zope.org
>
> Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com> writes:
> > I'm not sure what the relief you're asking for is. Just another
> > redirector in the root of the Z3 Wiki? Or something that would keep all
> > Zope 3 Wiki URL's short and sweet?
>
> The latter. Short, sweet, canonical and intuitive. zope.org/zope3 would be
> my choice.
>
> Thanks,
> -Simon
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:24:16 -0700
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] Re: fix zope 3 wiki urls ?
> Cc: zope-web@zope.org,
> zope3-dev@zope.org
> To: Simon Michael <simon@joyful.com>
> From: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
>
> You can use http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/FAQ. As long as Zope 3 is in
> development mode, I don't see what's wrong with that one.
> Unfortunately, since it's just a redirector, the URL's get expanded
> quickly to the big long ones. But you can share those abbreviated
> URL's just fine. I'm not sure if I want to add anything that would be
> doing any URL rewriting - particularly if it requires any support from
> Apache, unless we want to set up a subdomain (see below).
>
> On Friday, April 4, 2003, at 05:52 PM, Simon Michael wrote:
>
> > PS - yes, I know I'm asking ZC to do work for me and everyone there is
> > busy.. I thought I was going to be able to do it and the task naturally
> > led to this list. I'm hoping it's not a big technical deal and we can
> > get
> > this done.
> >
> > If not, we have a problem. Urls like
> > http://dev.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/FAQ
> > make
> > us look silly. :)
>
> Yes, but it's silly that makes sense. "Oh, a development site project
> wiki about a component architecture". Makes more sense than some of
> those other URL's 0,123312,4,092,12.html?pt.x.r.233.af.y ;)
>
> If you really want more than the redirector, let me know. But the
> advantage of the redirector is that (a) it's simple, and (b), it does
> allow for sharing of any URL below the redirected point. So
> http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/DevelCookbook is there and sharable.
>
> I think the next best thing would be a real subdomain, zope3.zope.org.
> Or zope3.org. There was some talk of this earlier that got shot down,
> but I'm not sure if what got shot down was the new domain, or setting
> up a whole extra server. I'm not opposed to doing a subdomain that
> just goes into the Zope 3 wiki. I think the concern was that we'd end
> up with another dogbowl or collector.zope.org that didn't quite match
> the rest of the "zope.org (in)experience" at a time when we should be
> unifying that experience. But, if the subdomain is in site, like
> dev.zope.org, it *shouldn't* be a problem.
>
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:27:19 -0700
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] NZO Alpha Announcement
> Cc: zope-web@zope.org
> To: Sidnei da Silva <sidnei@x3ng.com>
> From: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
>
> On Friday, April 4, 2003, at 04:01 PM, Sidnei da Silva wrote:
>
> >> I appreciate Pieter's roadmap page - but does this need to be a Wiki?
> >> Now there are all these extra headers and toolbars and links and
> >> sub-sub-sub tables and question marks getting in the way of trying to
> >> ascertain the current Zope release information. Too many header bars
> >> (the site bar and the wiki bar) feel like they're pushing information
> >> down on what wants to be a standalone page (evidenced by the very
> >> small table of contents, which shows up with NO NZO skin around
> >> it...). But I guess there's some Wiki skin work still ongoing? I
> >> don't know what can be done about this, but the page flow currently
> >> is just rather noisy.
> >
> > Yes, Limi is working on ZWiki skin beautification to get it ready for
> > 0.18.0.
> >
> > I agree with you that this roadmap page has way too many whistles. I
> > dislike table borders entirely.
>
> I made an alternate layout that's just straight text, and all done in
> pure Structured Text - no HTML. I really dislike the combination of
> the two, which I think many people fall back on because STX's rules are
> often unclear (I know I still get surprised too much when using it, and
> I've been using it for years and years now).
>
> http://dev.nzo.zope.org/Roadmap/AlternateLayout
>
> Oh, how I miss reStrucutredText's automatic table-of-content-generation
> abilities!
>
> >> If the Roadmap page should remain a Wiki page, then maybe pages like
> >> this are good candidates for the giganto-wiki that Simon proposed a
> >> few months back. I'm still leery of having the dichotomy of
> >> WikiSpace versus NormalContentSpace creating confusing navigation and
> >> duplicated content, but I'd rather have that than NormalContentSpace
> >> pierced by many little Wikis.
> >
> > I think that a Roadmap page is a nice candidate for a Wiki, but
> > whatever is suggested would be fine for me.
>
> Why a full Wiki on its own, just for the Roadmap? So anyone can update
> it? I see that as a valid want, but there's a lot of overhead just on
> the User Interface just to get a single editable page - particularly
> one that should have pretty good editorial control. I think a small
> group of Zope.org editors can update a normal document just fine here,
> with less overhead on the software side and so on. And since normal
> documents can have comments attached as part of the CMF framework, the
> community can still remind us to update, or add new information that
> the editors of the site can respond to.
>
> I agree with Simon's (much) earlier vision of a unified Zope.org Wiki.
> I'm still not a big Wiki fan, but unifying the non-development Wiki's
> instead of having many tiny ones is better. I still think a lot of
> what we may want (or may have wanted) Wikis for on the current Zope.org
> site can be satisfied with good editor setups and commentable pages.
> CMF's document system which doesn't require sudden switching to the ZMI
> makes editable pages easier.
>
> If it's meant to just be a standalone document, I'd rather have a
> standalone document than an entire Wiki that exists purely to support
> that one page. If we want it to be a Wiki page, then we should come up
> with a canonical content Wiki on the site and put it in there
> (...zope.org/wiki/RoadMap).
>
> I'd be happy with either solution.
>
>
>
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> Message: 11
> Date: Fri, 4 Apr 2003 18:36:06 -0700
> Subject: Re: [ZWeb] NZO Alpha Announcement
> Cc: Sidnei da Silva <sidnei@x3ng.com>,
> zope-web@zope.org
> To: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
> From: Jeffrey P Shell <jeffrey@cuemedia.com>
>
> > Why a full Wiki on its own, just for the Roadmap? So anyone can
> > update it? I see that as a valid want, but there's a lot of overhead
> > just on the User Interface just to get a single editable page -
> > particularly one that should have pretty good editorial control. I
> > think a small group of Zope.org editors can update a normal document
> > just fine here, with less overhead on the software side and so on.
> > And since normal documents can have comments attached as part of the
> > CMF framework, the community can still remind us to update, or add new
> > information that the editors of the site can respond to.
> >
> > I agree with Simon's (much) earlier vision of a unified Zope.org Wiki.
> > I'm still not a big Wiki fan, but unifying the non-development Wiki's
> > instead of having many tiny ones is better. I still think a lot of
> > what we may want (or may have wanted) Wikis for on the current
> > Zope.org site can be satisfied with good editor setups and commentable
> > pages. CMF's document system which doesn't require sudden switching
> > to the ZMI makes editable pages easier.
> >
> > If it's meant to just be a standalone document, I'd rather have a
> > standalone document than an entire Wiki that exists purely to support
> > that one page. If we want it to be a Wiki page, then we should come
> > up with a canonical content Wiki on the site and put it in there
> > (...zope.org/wiki/RoadMap).
>
> Ergh, by "I'd rather have a standalone document", I mean a standalone
> regular CMF Document.
>
> > I'd be happy with either solution.
>
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