[Grok-dev] Introducing Grok / KSS : feedback after 1 week

Balazs Ree ree at ree.hu
Mon Aug 25 07:43:14 EDT 2008

On Mon, 25 Aug 2008 13:07:36 +0200, Martijn Faassen wrote:

> Hi there,
> Balazs Ree wrote:
>> we are still waiting for his final opinion about the long discussion
>> about the commandsets issue, where we seemed to settle to a consensus
>> with Jeroen and Martijn, and he brought no other Zope3 issue to our
>> knowledge, since then.
> To be honest, I lost track of the command discussion. It was a LONG
> discussion and I lack KSS knowledge, so I don't feel myself part of any
> particular consensus. :)

In my reading, in the last reply that I gave to you, I gave up my 
original concerns and practically, accepted 
the solution that Jeroen and you suggested. However I found it important 
to point it out, what consequences this change will have to KSS in 
general, and how this will change our approach towards pythonic framework 

I agree that the conversation was long. Part of the problem was that 
unfortunately, I could not attend personally the Grokkerdam sprint, and 
that at the end of the sprint, Jeroen presented on the mailing list a 
decision about an issue into which I personally had invested a lot of 
work previously (not as much as Jeroen though), and that this decision 
was made without asking my opinion and it was quite contrary to what I 
believed to had settled with Jeroen, previously, when creating the 
kss.zope package together. So I had no other choice then argue in email.

That said, I am convinced that the new "python paradigm" of KSS will be 
benefitial to KSS and make it more accessible from pythonic frameworks.

> My general position is that if we can keep the integration with KSS as
> simple as possible and consisting of only Python concepts, we can build
> more sophisticated integrations with frameworks (such as Zope 3) when we
> want without burdening people who have no such requirements with
> possibly rather complicated abstractions.

Accepting the truth in your position was the main reason why I changed my 
original opinion on this subject.

I would also like to ask you that once we will have finalized all the 
changes, please take a final preview on the new kss.base / kss.zope from 
the pov of Python and Grok, and tell if you are consenting with the new 
api or you have additional improvement ideas.

Best wishes,

Balazs Ree

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